Ben Bailey - Candidate for Abilene City Council

Ben Bailey, candidate for Abilene City Council, answering 20 Rapid Fire questions followed by in depth discussion on how to spend $20 million in sale tax revenue, housing, how to budget time for public service, how we zone and increase the supply of housing, and where he'd like to see Abilene in ten years.

Vote: Early voting starts Monday. Runoff Election Day is June 13th. Don't let others decide the budget for you.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Ben, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me. I'm honored. I'm honored to be here. We're gonna jump right into the rapid fire questions. Uh it's gonna be about 20 questions. You have three seconds to respond. No political campaign speeches. This is just gut reaction.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 0:16

You ready?

SPEAKER_00 0:17

I'm ready.

SPEAKER_01 0:17

Number one, who has the best tacos in Abilene?

SPEAKER_00 0:21

Best tacos, uh La Popular. What was your very first paying job? Uh worked for uh Mancken and Sons. Um it used to be called the Garden Center way back in the day on on uh North First.

SPEAKER_01 0:36

What place is a hidden gem of Abilene that you would like more people to know about?

SPEAKER_00 0:42

Um so I'm the president of Eastern Little League, and we have uh a division called the Challengers Divis Division, which is for uh um special needs um and they play on Saturdays. And if you um have a soul and like baseball, it's it's a it's a beautiful thing to come watch them play.

SPEAKER_01 1:06

Rank these in priority roads, water, public safety, housing. Uh public safety, housing, water, roads. Best piece of advice you've ever received.

SPEAKER_00 1:20

Um just uh yes, ma'am, just say yes, ma'am, uh your wife is always right.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

What is your absolute number one priority if you're elected to the Abilene City Council?

SPEAKER_00 1:35

Uh try try to tackle the the housing issue.

SPEAKER_01 1:38

Okay. If you uh have to choose today, cut property taxes or increase the public safety budget? Oh man, uh cut taxes. First impression, people have a view that's wrong.

SPEAKER_00 1:57

Man, I don't I don't know. Uh I don't know what their first impression is. Um uh I have no idea what their first impression is. I I think that um man I I think I think a lot of people think that uh I my I'm quiet. Um this during this campaign. I I have been uh I'm I'm I'm outside my comfort zone on on on uh this campaigning. I'm excited about doing the job. I really am. Um and so I think I think probably uh with this I think there's a they they think that because I'm not loud that the that there's no passion. Um that's a lot longer than three seconds, sorry. But no, I I I care a lot deeper than than um I'll I'll just say I'm I'm outside my comfort zone of doing all this.

SPEAKER_01 2:57

Cedar Ridge Reservoir. Support or against? Support. Books or movies? Books. What's your favorite book? James. That's the title of the book, James? Yeah, it was written by the the brother of Christ. Oh, okay. Oh, I see. Okay. What can the city do to help with the housing shortage in Abilene in one to three words? Uh cut the red tape. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 3:22

Are Abilene Roads getting better or worse? Both. Um on one end they're they're getting better, and then by the time we get to the other end, they're getting worse, and we're it's it's like sweeping, we've got to do it every day.

SPEAKER_01 3:35

What's one thing that makes you more qualified than your opponent? Experience. What's one compliment of you either of either your opponent or the current city council your choice?

SPEAKER_00 3:47

Uh my opponent. Uh she is uh she's passionate and she's kind, and I've uh uh feel it's a privilege to have gotten to know her.

SPEAKER_01 3:58

Is the city doing a better job right now with transparency? Yes or no? Yes. What is one city service that currently, in your opinion, deserves an A grade? Uh first responders. What's one city service that currently gets an F grade from you? Uh Jay Patterson.

SPEAKER_00 4:18

No, I uh I no, he uh he's brand new, so I um I had a g I gotta throw him under. No, I I don't I don't think there there's any F because there's always a room there's always room for improvement, but let me put it this way, and I rephrased it for Tammy.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

Uh what's a department that needs improvement?

SPEAKER_00 4:40

Um I think cross the board, all of them. Um and uh I I'm and this is a longer longer answer than probably needed to be, but um And we can get into it later, but I think I think I think there's just like every we always need to be uh there's always room for improvement. Um but I think I think each individual city employee is doing a great job.

SPEAKER_01 5:08

If you had been on the council three years ago, would you have voted for or against the Lanceum data center?

SPEAKER_00 5:14

Um I think this is a hard question because I uh privy to what I know now, I I would be for it.

unknown 5:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

And then finally finish this sentence. In ten years, Abilene will be blank. The place to come home to.

unknown 5:29

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:29

Very good. All right, rapid fire done with. All right. Now we can jump into uh some of the the issues with a little bit more more in-depth. Um let's see here. Uh so uh first one, um the city council just had the budget discussion uh last week and roughly uh $20 million in sales tax, call it excess funds or additional funds that the city has this year to spend. Um what's your uh take on how the city should should spend that additional $20 million? And and be as specific as possible if it's a program, if it's a park, if it's a if it's roads, if it's where do we need to allocate that $20 million in resources?

SPEAKER_00 6:22

Um Capital improvement projects for sure. I I will say that um roads are gonna always been be an issue. Um if you've traveled to any city outside of Abilene, everybody's everybody's tackling that. Um that we're we're not the we're not the only city that tackles that. So um one thing I I will say uh for the last 20 25 years, uh the city has poured over $200 million into uh into water, um making us more uh drought resilient. Um so I would say for this, and this is this is something I I the last 10 years, if if you've moved here in the last 10 years, then you don't understand what a drought is. I've walked across Lido Lake without getting muddy. That's what a drought is. And there was times in the 80s and the 90s and the early 2000s that we reached drought, drought of not water restrictions. Dude, you're not watering your yard. Right. Like lakes are not just not full, they're dried up. Um my wife, my wife tells a story that they built a lake, they they lived close to Lido Lake, and they built a fort at the bottom, and like right now at the bottom of Lido Lake, there's a fort that my wife built. Nice. Um so I I I would like to see in and and we we've done a lot to continue um building uh that water resilience, uh, and that drought resilience, I guess I should say. Um But the last 10 years has been nice. We've had a lot of rain. Um and not to mention the uh the technology that we've poured in over the last 20 years, the $200 million that uh in uh water conservation, uh water reusage, there's have been a lot of things that that we've gone into. But um, man, if you're if you're a true West Texan, um you never complain when it rains. And so I would I would say uh roads, yes, that that'd be great. Um but uh yeah, I think I like we can never um uh spend too much money on on being prepared for a drought. Because when you when you've seen that drought, you know, you know what it's like.

SPEAKER_01 9:02

Um so yeah, I hope that well and they do tend to come in cycles, so roughly every 10 years we're in a drought, and then people forget when we're in a a good rainy season and then it comes back. So, you know, it may be two years, maybe five years from now, but it will happen. We just don't know what year, but it is gonna happen. Yeah. Um so that kind of dovetails into um priorities. So every candidate I feel like comes in with two or three kind of top priorities. You know, for me, when I ran in 23, it was, you know, how do we retain our graduates here instead of leading them over to Dallas? How do we develop um I-20? Um, you know, so you kind of come in with with some passion projects or focus, and uh, you know, Tammy uh is is uh big on transparency and communication. And she has other other um things that she's passionate about, but if you if someone were to say, hey, that's what Tammy's passionate about, I think people could could articulate one or two. Uh hopefully after my campaign they could they could have said the same thing. Oh, Blaze is very you know pro-growth, or or you know, these two or three things. Uh for you, what are one or two or three things that you would want the listeners to go? I've never met Ben, um, but I know from this conversation this is this these are the two three issues that he is passionate about that he'd love to actually implement implement these changes. Whether he does or not, you know, hey, there's a whole process for that, but this is what I know Ben's gonna be passionate about.

SPEAKER_00 10:33

Uh man, um all right, so you said two or three. Um I I'm gonna I'll I'll set on three. Um one, one that you mentioned, um retainage of talent. Uh being a uh small business owner, if I hire somebody and train them up for a year and then they leave, and that is a huge waste of my investment into that employee. Yeah. I look at our children the same way. And I look at our the uh like from the universities to even from our high school, so you mentioned it to retaining that uh that talent. We spend it there there's a there's an investment that we make to our our children from kindergarten up through our universities. If they graduate and they move, man, that is a lot of money and investment that we spent just wasted, and now now we got young lawyers, we got young doctors that that are now in Fort Worth and now in Dallas, and and it's a man, so I was born and raised here. Uh I graduated from Abilene High and uh and then late later ACU, and then I went into the Navy, and uh we got to a point we were we were living in San Diego, which is not an ugly place to live. Um, I mean San Diego is beautiful, but we wanted our children raised here. So my wife and I decided to move back here. So I think so that's priority number one is creating an environment that man, I would love for my boys and my my children to go serve their country, to to go do whatever, but then to I would love to be part of the creation of a of a city that they say, hey, I want to, I wanna I want to end up here and and raise a family. So retention of talent, retention of our children. Um number two, um our downtown. When I was when I was a child in the uh in the 80s, I was born in in 1981. Um I'm not gonna say the years, but I remember I was in uh elementary school and I saw the Grace Museum, um, the grand opening of the Grace Museum, because before that it was uh a dilapidated old hotel. Um same with the the Paramount. Downtown was nothing but a uh a post office. That's what downtown was. Yeah. Um and so I I saw a lot of uh leaders over the years pour into money and time and effort to build up our downtown. That's one of those things that I believe is a that's an ongoing, we have to continue building up our downtown. There's a book called The Death of A of an American City, and it talks about uh when cities depart from downtown, from they they depart, because that's the heartbeat. When they depart from that, that's when cities start to degrade. Um, and so so yeah, number one, retainage of of our youth. Number two, downtown. Number three, I was born and raised on um North Ninth and Pioneer. And I I know I'm running for uh place four, which is uh South Side, which what I don't think a lot of citizens know that they're voting for At large. At large, yeah. It's it's not uh and I think that's um people don't understand that. I've had so many people go, oh well I I live on the north side, and I'm like, yeah, dude, your vote still counts. Yeah against the city. Yeah, it's you're it's I I'm not just representing there, it's just that's the place I can run for. Um and so no, I was I was born and raised on that on that side of town, and uh on the North Ninth and Pioneer, and I don't know if you if you're familiar with it. Um man, it's a it's it's a forgotten area of our of our city, I believe. Um and man, I played Pop Warner there, I played for the Buccaneers, the Bucks. Uh I gotta give a shout out to Johnny Lackey. Um, man, I'm a buck for life. Um and uh man, the little league that I played for, Lone Star, is no longer there. Um and man, that is that's a forgotten neighborhood. And I just throw out that one because I know that neighborhood and that's where I was born or raised. But there's a lot of those neighborhoods across the town that are just forgotten. Um and so that's my that that's my third priority is to not forget about those those uh forgotten neighborhoods.

SPEAKER_01 15:28

I would say, yeah, the northwest quadrant of Ablin is probably the one that gets the least amount of attention as far as uh uh just across the board, whether it's uh city or in media or whatever, you know. I think the northeast gets the universities, HSU, ACU, I-20, that kind of quarter, Walmart. Which is great, yeah. Yeah, and and which uh, you know, on the south side, pretty much the entire south side, I feel like gets gets a fair amount of love and attention. And I feel like the next um the next front, I think, is the northwest, northwest side of Abilene. I think there's a lot of potential there, and I think it's it's slowly pushing that way, and I think it's there's a lot of really nice neighborhoods in there, and so I think there's a lot of potential there. So that's that's always that's a that's good to hear. Um so what I uh what I did for this interview and and and for your opponent's interview as well is I talked to some people and I said, all right, what are some issues that you would love to ask these candidates that's kind of putting you, let's say, in the middle where you don't know how to vote, and you go, well, if you were able to ask these questions, you know, what would those questions be that would help you kind of make a decision or swing the pendulum one way or the other towards one candidate or the other, right? And what kind of concerns have have you encountered along the campaign that you'd want to answer in the oh, okay, there's the answer that's gonna swing me, you know, um that that makes more sense. So uh and I work these in with your opponent's um uh interview as well, uh for you it seems to be the concern or the question has been uh we haven't seen too much of Ben. Uh Tammy, Tammy has been on the city council um scene, let's say, for for many years. Uh some love it, some don't. Um, you know, but she's she's at the city council meetings for many years, um you know, and she's been about that transparency and communication. People know her, again, good or bad, whether you like her or not, she is she's there, and so people kinda she's a known quantity, I think. Uh for you, you're just stepping in on the scene, and for a lot of people, this is their first time, you know, meeting you, which is true of every candidate. You know, I was oh people know me, and I get out there and 90% of people do not know me, and it's a very humbling experience. So for you, um I think the question uh that has been posed is well, uh one, why is he running? Uh, and then two, does he have the time to adequate adequately um give towards really reading the packets and serve the city council as as needed and not just be a rubber stamp? So for those two, those two questions, the listener out there that's going, man, I know Tammy, maybe I don't agree with her on a lot of things, but she at least puts in the time and she's been involved for you know five, six years or whatever, I know what she's about. Whereas Ben, I'm just now getting to know him, right? Or I've just heard his name, but I don't know anything about him. How do you how do you address one, why you're running in in a short version, but also two, the devotion or the need for time because you're a busy guy with your business and with your with other your other activities, you know, it's it's a huge time sink for city council. How do you address those two concerns?

SPEAKER_00 18:48

Uh I think that I mean that's a great question. Um all right, why am I running? Um, I I hate to just continue to say this, but I I can't reiterate it enough. This is my home. Um I'm my my kids are the seventh generation from being from here. And that that tracks back to uh the Civil War. That's how long we've been here. Um and so so this is my home. And I and I and I I left a job in the Navy that I loved um that I was good at. Um in a city, San Diego, that was was fun, it was a great place. But I we left that specifically to be here. Not just we didn't we didn't get stationed here. Nothing against Air Force. I love the Air Force, but I was born here, I left, and I joined the Navy, and but I moved back here to raise my family here. Um because of the values, because of the people, because man, there's not I can't walk around the block without somebody that's that that's spanked me and gotten me in in line in some in some form or fashion. Right. So um, and I'm trying to wait, watch my language, and I'm I'm sorry, like I uh I know my wife is out there like, I mean, he's a sailor, he's gonna say something. But um but anyway, so so that's why I'm running because I I saw over my lifetime I saw my my family and my friends and uh so many leaders of this community just step up and and transform this community from um being a dusty old uh rail stop to being a thriving community. Um and I want to be part of that story. I want to be part of this story for my children because I I pray that my that my children will go serve their country. I do that that's something that's important. Um I've had uh um I I recently gave my my mom a uh a framed portrait of all the portraits but that uh we've had somebody from our family serve in in the military. Um well the portraits we've had it through the civil uh from the revolution, but in including um the Alamo. But I have portraits from the Civil War in every war until uh the war on terror, including myself and and um so service in the military has been a big thing in our family and I pray that my kids will do that, and then I and then I pray that my children will will then come back and continue to serve the community that uh that we have for uh seven generations. So that's why I'm running. Um because I just care deeply about this. And and it goes back to that that that prior question about, you know, when I was telling you about the north side. Like I like I know those just different neighborhoods that I'm like, man, last ten years this one's getting forgotten. Hey, this one that over here the there's a there's a uh uh there's a people that have been forgotten. So I I I know Abilene in an intimate way. Um so that's the answer to your first your first question of why I'm running. Um I think I think it's a a a very uh valid and yet um of of the time that I can spend. Um our founding fathers when it came to um uh service to our country it was it's it's supposed to be a sacrifice it is supposed to be a sacrifice it's not supposed to be a uh a career it's not supposed to be um when you have time um I did four combat tours when I was in the Navy none of those did I have time and it was just like carved out like hey you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna go fight um no I I I left my family I left better things that like for personal I I could have done a lot thing a lot of things different I could have made more money I could have pursued uh personal goals but I didn't 9-11 happened and it pissed me off and I went to go fight for my country um where we stand right now um yeah I I I look at city council I look at any elected office it is it's it's supposed to be a sacrifice and so I'm I'm willing to sacrifice my business and I'm willing to sacrifice my time with my family because that's what I've done my entire adult life to serve my community and to serve my country so yes no yeah I I completely I get that question of man does he have time no but you know what voter voter turnout was pathetic it was rough and and people go oh man I'm too busy if you're too busy to not vote I'm I have four kids I have a full time full time job I have a location here Lubbock in San Angelo um like I am I'm maxed out I don't golf I don't I don't I don't have hobbies my life is work and and fathering and I'm willing to sacrifice for this community go vote if you you can take the 10 seconds to go to go vote so no I I think that uh I think it's a valid question but I think it's like mixed I think it's a misunderstanding of why the how our system is really set up there's a light on the on the Capitol um in the Capitol at in Washington DC when when Congress is in session there's a light and whenever it goes off it means they're no longer in session and that goes back to a historical fact that uh most of them used to be farmers or businessmen lawyers whatever and that let their wives know that they're coming home for dinner. That's what it used to to that that sounds very like uh uh when I'm having a daughter I I became a feminist but um but back then uh they were they were all men but but that let them know like hey they're coming home and uh and it let the entire city let everybody know that hey they're dumb they're not no longer in session they're they're going home for dinner and they're going back to work they all had jobs they were farmers um I think now uh our our government is way overpaid like it it became a it became a profession and that is the like downfall of our country it is supposed to be a sacrifice just like go joining the military when I went I sacrificed my time and my and I was willing to give my life for and we just we just ended uh you know we just celebrated Memorial Day so many people gave their life and not just the life they live but the life that they could have lived for your right to vote and and so yes I I yes I'm I'm I'm gonna be busy to answer the question I'm gonna be busy but I I expect that and I and I and I and I look at it as man I'm I'm willing to sacrifice that time my sacrifice my time and my efforts for a better community.

SPEAKER_01 26:34

I'll we'll end in this topic on on this kind of last question and this is where where they'll I'll say well well what do you mean by that and and they'll they'll really get specific and they'll say man those packets can be 500 pages 900 pages you get them on a Friday you read through them and then you ask questions you know come Monday some you know will skim it some will read it twice some will read it three times 900 pages you know it's a good investment of time just just from a practical hour standpoint um and that that send tends to be the the question is oh is is he gonna have even time to read the packet uh that he can discuss it intelligently come come Thursday at the meeting so how would you respond to that to the listener out there going I don't know if Ben's gonna have the time to even read the packet so he's not gonna be too well informed every other week how do you kind of address that concern out there same thing um I I will um anything that I that I've ever uh undertaken um I don't I don't I'm on several different boards um and every time I I undertake a board that I don't do it without saying hey like I'm committing myself I I I don't I don't do stuff half assed and um well you're you might have to you're good sorry um I I just I don't I I when it on once I do something you whole ass things you don't have to I whole ass things I whole like I know if if I'm gonna if I'm gonna do something I'm gonna I'm I'm I'm gonna go all in um and that that that's honestly kind of a my wife probably is bless her heart man she um so I'll say this I when I went into the Navy um like I've mentioned I did I did four tours I volunteered for the for the last two um and uh because that's that's because I I I believe that hey this is why I'm here man um you know uh if my if not me then who?

SPEAKER_00 28:43

And I I wouldn't I wouldn't have put my name in the hat if I wasn't ready to to do the work.

SPEAKER_01 28:53

Hopefully I answered very good yeah all right so let's shift a little bit to um you know we've got the massive changes happening in Abilene whether it's data center Great Lakes Cheese the the base expansion um you know ripple effects as far as housing childcare um people are being priced out of of of some some uh things and we're seeing that especially hit a little harder in the lower income or the retirees that are on fixed income especially if their rent's going up or grocery prices you know there's some national issues that that are also taking place not just local gas prices going up grocery prices et cetera um how how do you how do you look at it or and and what are some solutions that you see for city council um that they can tackle part of that housing or the the expense part of uh of the increase for our residents so that they're not priced out and so they're not having to move to other cities because Abilene's too expensive for them now?

SPEAKER_00 29:55

I d I think it's uh very simple um there's a lot of there's a lot of developers that are coming in here trying to uh with the housing issue there's there's more people looking for homes than the than there are homes.

SPEAKER_01 30:12

That's and and so I'm I'm a capitalist and I look at uh let the market uh handle itself so as a city councilman um there are I don't want to say like fire and forget like you you got to do it uh in a thoughtful manner make sure that uh neighborhoods uh maintain their their integrity um but at the same time man cut the red tape uh make make sure that that developers are doing it in a um thoughtful manner and that that neighborhoods do not lose that their their their identity but get out of the way because the market will the market will uh will adjust for it um I I'm I'm a I'm a huge believer in um government is normally the problem and uh so let people uh tackle it from there right so um I mean not taking it out of you know we we there the the government does have it does serve a purpose but it's to to maintain public safety um maintain the roads make sure zoning makes sense and after that so let's talk about zoning and housing um that seems to be where where part of the conversation is you know hey we need more housing right so it's every city council decision or really government decision is a balancing act there's there's pros and cons to either side which one has less downside all right fine we'll go with the other route so with housing and zoning obviously we Abling needs more housing and so the current council's approach for the last two three years has been all right let's be a little bit more aggressive in allowing um zoning that allows for additional types of housing next to existing neighborhoods right and so that's come up against the the NIMBY's right not in my backyard right well you get well yeah we need more housing but not here right I I pay good money for my house and if you build that nearby that's going to decrease the value of my house or it's gonna increase traffic or whatever the reasons are and it's typically three sided every time is well yes we need more housing but not near me. And so that's the pushback of well zoning does the council as a policy standpoint do we allow more housing zoning that normally we would have said oh that's a different type of housing next to this type of housing we won't allow it but now we need the housing do we allow more zoning or do we push back and say no we want to keep the character of Abilene the same as it's been for the last 50 years so we're gonna keep it tight but we understand that that's going to lead to lower inventory in housing and so that's going to increase rent maybe for the next three four five years. So where's your personal standpoint on that?

SPEAKER_00 33:11

Man it's uh man they they tackled that today and they they've been tackling it several times. Man I I I will say uh I I totally get neighborhoods saying hey man I just like I bought this house three years ago and now you're gonna bring in a um a townhome and and that's gonna like I I I get that um I think one I'm sorry I think you got to tackle it case by case um I think you have to listen to the people listen to to to the residents um man I um I don't know if it's appropriate or not I but um um councilman price a couple of uh not today but two weeks ago and there was uh a case that came up with this that that he like almost had his mind like it was it just like made sense and uh and then it was like a hundred percent of the neighborhood came out and was like we're opposed to this and he was like uh man like I I can't vote for that so I like I mean I I commend him for that of he he and I may be speaking out but it seemed like what it from his comments and it seemed like he had this is a no-brainer man we can we can build a multifamily home here and and this is great right and uh but to hear from those those uh those neighbors that are going man that's not so one I think as a city councilman we do represent the people that live here currently um and so I think you have to you have to take those hard questions and and listen to the people so if that neighborhood is against it I know there's a long long way of answering your question I guess my point is is that you have like I I'm for man let's just build all you know but you can't you can't destroy a neighborhood and destroy uh property values over just like hey let's just get beds right get racks in here you know um and I say racks uh being from the Navy um because in the Navy we're we're guaranteed uh a rack and three squares a day um but uh my point is is that you I think you have to look at it case by case secondly um the hard thing is now you're faced with how much land is in within Appling and what are we well willing to develop um then what's outside of Appling then you're looking at tax uh you know they're not they're not paying the same taxes as the Right um do they do they use our uh sewage do they use our infrastructure man there there's a lot of those questions um man it is it is not an easy um it's it's not an easy answer so I I I think you have to like you have to as as a business owner um and in the military um I've been faced with a lot of like just though those types of problems that you're damned if you are you're damned if you're not you know what I mean like whatever you do like it it's it sucks what one way or the other but that's that's part of the reason why you're up there.

SPEAKER_01 36:44

You know what I mean? So yeah so what would be your you know I think I think there's a there's the mentality of well we can rely on staff to come up with solutions. But part of the role and and a lot of it is but a part of the role of city council and the individuals on the council is to also propose solutions that staff then works out and goes yeah that works or no that's not going to work or let's let's try it and see. So from a on housing just because it's such a huge issue right now you've got the need I mean put the data centers aside just from the the base and Great Lakes cheese but a lot of the a lot of the the need will be from the base uh expansion uh airmen needing housing off base we're looking at you know depending on your metrics three to four thousand we need three to four thousand homes a year um built every year for the next eight years that's a lot of housing and I think that how it's been done um has kind of worked for Ablin because we've only grown one or two percent each year and so it's been very slow moderate growth now we're we're ramping up crazy from a I think for the listeners it it's important for them to know okay well does Ben does Ben agree that we need more housing or Ben is that no let's keep the character and our population the same we don't need to grow yeah the cost is we've you know we'll get a little increase in rent right and and for some that'll be a huge jump double rent or whatever um or it's no we do need more housing and very importantly in your mind how do we increase the the housing that comes online by three or four thousand without without the red tape cutting red tape which I think is a is is a fair one but um it's kind of the catch-all answer right do you have specifics of yeah we really need to be doing X in order to ramp up housing it's a uh I don't want to answer this question right cut red tape. Yeah uh man on honestly no we need we need more housing um and I I don't have a just hard fact solution and no no disrespect neither do you and neither neither does anybody because otherwise it'd be done right so um well let me let me ask then uh so but we but we need we've got to have we've got to have more housing we we have to right um and uh and I think that there is I don't I don't look at any challenge as a a detriment I always look at that that there's a uh underlying opportunity um and so I think that's where how we have to look at this I don't have the answer I don't and right I think I think how council and and this is where I would maybe get like to get your opinion on or or insights into okay council is okay we have a we have a housing problem we need additional housing whether that's three or four thousand a year whatever it is so we've uh we've been much more aggressive on zoning so that's that's the one third of the the issue two we've uh really pushed the rebuild abbey which is a million dollars that we've set aside to build good quality homes in the interior part of Abilene uh that helps the tax base but it also gives families housing in the interior uh that's set at a million now the council can increase that to 1.5 or decrease it they can change instead of the the developer having to sell it at 200,000 now they can build a home and sell it at 25000. So those are the two kind of decisions that the council could really affect rebuild Abbey as needed. And then the other that we implemented after the strategic meeting back in January I believe was uh staff created a map of Abilene where showing all the properties that are utility ready that are build ready and and we don't own those properties just to show developers hey here are the properties that if you want to build tomorrow these guys are ready to go and so just to kind of cut the red tape cut the timing down and go in here we'll make it as easy as possible right so those were kind of two or three um things that that council did go okay we've we've got to help I think the mapping was a clear clear win and and council didn't come up with that staff member came up with that and and and Matt over in the the the water department did um but on the rebuild abbey any any thoughts on that program um I think I think it's brilliant man I I I really do because I think you you know you drive around uh drive around town and it goes back to we were talking about those forgotten neighborhoods you know there man there there's some lots there there's some places there that uh you could can completely go hey instead of instead of tearing down this neighborhood over here man there's a there's a lot right here um I think there's some things that need to go into place uh to make that more attractive um so I think where where you can build up and it comes down to streets it comes down to safety uh it comes down to um not just like hey let's let's put a housing project here and people are gonna are are gonna move here I mean if it's uh if it's a forgotten neighborhood um both commercially um I mean people aren't gonna move they're they're gonna go yeah that's that's great man I'm not I'm not moving there yeah so you you you so it's uh you know the streets have been forgotten on the on that side of town the you know so um so it's not just a residential issue and it goes back to uh you know everybody talks about the streets which honestly I think y'all have done a great job that you are on the council I think the I think y'all done a great job on the streets if you go if you go to if you travel anywhere across the nation across the world yeah streets are an issue period yeah it's just it's always it's not Abilene specific and once you once you complete it on this side of town you're gonna have to start it over the yeah but um but I think they're all interconnected um it you know you know what a lattice works you know like none of these problems are just a standalone problem um you asked me earlier on uh uh supporting existing businesses or uh or promoting new businesses now I say promote new businesses because that that in turn supports existing businesses I own an air conditioning and plumbing company if more if more new businesses come in and that helps that helps me already um same thing when it comes down to the housing you have to you you can't just look at it like just build a house here people move in all right that's just not how it works and there's a lattice work of of how people move you know what I mean like if there's if there's nothing attractive on that side of town they're not gonna move there yeah if they if if it's dangerous if there's if um if that's a a high crime neighborhood you can build all the homes in the world yeah people aren't gonna move there same with The school system. If the school's not good, no family's gonna move their ticket and put them into that school.

SPEAKER_00 44:04

So it's it's uh like you can't just say, Oh, we're building homes here, move over here. Yeah. Uh man, no. Yeah. You know, so everything's interconnected.

SPEAKER_01 44:15

What's um I feel like every candidate, when they start off on the campaign trail, they have their reasons and uh they uh they know what they're gonna talk about. Most though discover along the way, oh, I didn't know that was an issue, or oh, the feedback from from residents or citizens is oh, okay, this this is a bigger issue than I expected. Um and I need to learn about it or address it. Um what's a what's an issue that you may not have known or or known that it was such a big deal starting off on your campaign, but over the last what almost six months now, what's an issue that that feedback from residents has made you aware? Oh, okay, this is this is becoming an issue that I need to really be aware of and dive into.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

Anything? Uh the uh and and I shouldn't say this because this is uh like a um the data centers. I mean I I think and and I'll and I'll just say I I think there's a lot of uh misinformation and I think there's a lot of just um just a lack of communication. And and I don't even say think think it's communication as much. It's just a uh uh I guess uh I said it first, just misunderstanding of of of what's going on. That that's that's my perception of it. I mean, you know, you you get uh everybody's like, man, they're they're taking all our water. Man, they're just they're and that's that's not from from my understanding and everything that I've learned since then uh of running, that's not the case. So I I think that that's a big issue. Um, and I and I and I understand every every citizen's uh concern with it because man, it's it's like uh man, it's the unknown. Yeah. Right? And Donald Rumsfeld said you don't know what you don't know, right? Like it's it man, it like scares people when you don't know something, you're like, man, this is crazy.

SPEAKER_02 46:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:11

Um and so I think there is a uh a lot of misinformation and just misunderstanding of that situation. And I'm and I'm not really coming out saying like, oh everybody one way is right or wrong. Um but I think the better you understand something, the more the the less fear you have on something, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_01 46:38

Well, and I you know I'll take the blame on that. I think you know uh city council, myself included, um, could have and and should have done a better job about communicating out. Now some of that is is uh confidential because it's an economic agreement and and and I think unfortunately we as a council went, well, it's all confidential, so we're people are just gonna move on. We're not going to take the extra step of addressing those concerns and really pushing it. No, here's the good information, here's the correct information. And I think that's something that council has to has to really keep at. It's not a, oh, well, we did a press release and we're good. And I'm taking, you know, one-seventh responsibility for that as well, is that council has to do a better job about getting the information out there not just once, not twice, but over and over and over again to address those concerns because you're right. The the fear of the unknown is, and and if there's a void of information, people will fill it with their worst fears. I do it, you do it, everyone does it. And so we've got to fill the void with good information, and really no one else can do it. Um, you know, Maury and the in the communications department, our city manager, uh, can help with that, but ultimately city council members are that bridge. That is their job. And so um I wish that I could have done a better job. I wish council as a whole we could have done a better job, but that's something where I see moving forward.

SPEAKER_00 48:00

So you know, one thing on in in y'all's in your defense, uh it's the information's there. Right? Like uh like a lot of time what what's available, it it's there. Um and uh you know I I it's the same thing as like going and and voting and every of of telling everybody, dude, if you if you complain about the roads tomorrow and you didn't vote, I don't want to hear it. The information's there. You can go, you can be an informed voter, you can be an informed citizen, you can. Right. It just takes the it takes the uh it takes that extra effort.

SPEAKER_01 48:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 48:40

And so no, I I honestly I think I think the city council, you asked me earlier uh about transparency and and everything, I think y'all do a great job. And and uh I I do just because I run a business, I have my family, and and like everybody gets busy with their day-to-day. Yeah, man, I can't just expect for you to spoon feed me information. Yeah. Like if I if I care, yeah, I'm gonna look at it. And so I I just implore people to go, yes, hey, look into it and and ask those questions. Because I mean, I've I haven't known you a whole long time, but I've known you long enough that like man, you've answered questions if I've ever had to ask. And it's the same with with Travis and and everybody on the council, like many, like I you've got to ask the questions though.

SPEAKER_01 49:31

Yeah, right? I think uh uh you know, on any level of government, I think as social media becomes more and more of our way of communication and receiving information, I think councils across the nation need to be aware that, hey, you can you can have all the right information and make the right decisions, but if you lose control of the narrative because someone has an agenda that's about spreading false information or misinformation or or fear, and you lose the narrative and and the true narrative, well, there are going to be some real consequential uh actions to that. And so that's where I encourage people. Hey, the information may be out there, but I think council members and council as a whole has to recognize the fact that, hey, we need to do a better job about maybe not spoon feeding, but at least getting the word out over and over again. Yeah. Um okay, so uh coming one one, two more questions. Um I don't even know how long we've been doing this, maybe.

SPEAKER_00 50:23

I think we're we know we're doing all right. Not too bad, not too bad.

SPEAKER_01 50:26

Um what um let's see, what where do you see um I I like asking this question. Where do you see abling in 10 to 15 years? I think a lot of people, especially when you're on city council, it is it is that that analogy of uh oh, you're walking through the trees and you just see the tree that's hitting you in the face, right? The issue, whether it's a neighborhood zoning fight, whether it's a a water fight, whatever it is, it's just it's issue, it's fight, it's fight, it's issue after issue hitting you in the face, right? And you really kind of lose track of wait, what are we shooting for in 10 years or 15 years trying to take the city? What path are we trying to beat through the woods to get here? Um and I think it's important, at least starting off, to have a vision, hey, this is my goal. I know that once I'm on council, I'm gonna be in the weeds of it, and it's gonna be reaction, and it's gonna be hard to remember well, what are we shooting for as a community, right? So in 10, and you can kind of pick your horizon, 10 or 15 years, through all of this, the the the high rent right now, the childcare, the data center, the base expansion, all that kind of stuff. What are you envisioning abling to look like in 10 years? What's the goal that you say, hey, we reached it? There's gonna be another goal after that, but yeah, this is where I'd love for us to be.

SPEAKER_00 51:42

Um man, I'm I'm I'm kind of a romantic um man, that shining city on the hill. Like I uh there there's a mass migration from the the big cities and and they're you know from uh the Metroplags people are are are seeking out and and so we're growing. Um and I I think over the over the last uh 40 years of my life I've I've seen a lot of uh leaders in this community already start that trend of um building a pretty uh pretty cool place to live in. Um I I I really feel that way. Um and I can I I'm I'm not gonna go down a list because I'll I'll forget somebody because the list is large because there there's been a lot of people that have um go from elected officials to just investors to just people that that that care about the community. Um but yeah man, I that that shining city on a hill. I would I would love for Abling to I I would love to uh for Texas to go, man, whatever they're doing, right? I mean they uh ten years ago they had a uh a severe housing issue. And look what they did. Like man, and it it's not easy. Yeah. I mean it's a it's a fight. But they did it. And uh and you know I I will say this, you know, I went back like earlier I was talking about uh challenges that there's a uh underlying opportunity. The fact that we have a housing problem is a good thing. Yeah. That means people want to live here. It means we as a city aren't dying. Yeah, like people want to live here. So that's so that's cool.

SPEAKER_01 53:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 53:38

So let's lean into that that we we're a place that people want to be here. Same thing with the data centers. People they want to be here. Um and and there's a reason they want to be here is our identity, man, our values. Um and you can't uh um you can't throw a rock without hitting a church here, and I think that's a pretty good thing. Um, and uh so no, I yeah, I mean, how do we get there? Man, these conversations, um, keep in the fight. Uh I I don't know everything. For sure, I for sure don't know everything. Like I most people are smarter than I am, but uh uh but I'm I but I know a lot of smart people and and I think like just uh having that goal of how do we become that shining city is that I think that I I think that's a uh a noble goal.

SPEAKER_01 54:36

I like it. Last question. Um we see on the national level and and even on the state level a lot of division where um people get frustrated of oh America, we're so divided, I wish we were more united, and that's on both sides, left, right, liberal, conservative, doesn't matter. Oh, wish we were more united. But when it comes down to five or ten issues, that's when people put their, you know, put their foot down and go, well, no, we should be we should be united on everything else, but this is my issue that I'm passionate about. And how dare you be on the other side of this, whatever the issue is, right? And so it becomes real personal real fast. Uh, and then that bleeds into everything else. Now, on the local level, it is it is that, but it's very personal, right? It's not just social media posts of Ken Paxton or Trump or whoever it is. It's on a personal, oh, it's my neighbor, oh, it's my uh guy that I you know I do business with, or oh, it's it's uh my you know my wife's best friend, or you know, it's it's much more personal. Uh the decisions that you make are much more impactful on people that you personally know. Uh and so it get it can get real heated and angry and and and vicious uh on the local level. How do you approach that um that kind of almost reality with with the goal hopefully of kind of uniting um and moving forward as one city? How do you go, well, that's a fair concern? I don't agree with you, but I'm gonna hear you out maybe 10% of the time you're right. That's a fair point. But all the rest is just uh uh rhetoric that makes no sense. There's misinformation, but there's there's gems in there. They're they're angry at you, it's a it's a divisive issue, but you still as a council member have to listen and go, oh, that's that little point right there, that was a fair one. How do you approach it personally? Trying to take the nuggets of good out of it, um, and kind of separating, maybe not separating your personal feelings, but still being able to bring the the council and the and the city together and move us forward. Um so hardest question ever.

SPEAKER_00 56:42

So I'm gonna I I'm I'm gonna um uh answer this in in a in a couple of different ways. Um first of all, uh Speaker of the House, Tip O'Neill, who said uh all all politics is local. So it all it all starts with us, right? Like so on the grand nation, so you can't you can't separate the two um because uh it it starts it starts here locally. Um so I think accessibility is is the um and I'm talking about personal face-to-face accessibility. We have we we live in a world um of artificial intelligence is uh you know you can chat GPT, like give me a response to whatever. And you and it it's uh like you just generate. So like um I I'm using my GI bill. I got my I got my uh first degree in political science and history, and now I'm using my my second I'm using the GI bill to get my second degree in in uh engineering, mechanical engineering. And I had a professor talk about AI, and it said, like, yeah, that's great, but um we gotta make sure that we stay relevant. Um and that's just like if you think about that, make sure like our minds stay relevant, that we that we're not completely artificial. Social media is pushing this artificial, just you can say whatever you want on because you're not gonna see that person. No, you can say something about me on social media, but we're sitting here looking at each other, and it's a lot harder to go Ben you sock. Yeah, you know what I mean? Like it's a lot harder to but so I I I look at that that that accessibility in our world right now of true authentic uh conversation is rare. Um, so I'm gonna I I've got a story um I've that I've I've shared on a couple of things. Um in it, I mean you can come down to my office and look at it and verify it. Um I've got a uh a letter from my great-grandfather. In 1948, he wrote General MacArthur. Um and he my great-grandfather was uh, if you think 1948, this three years after the bombs have been dropped, um, and and he was in Tokyo, he was overseeing, he was the Supreme Malay commander, he was overseeing the reconstruction of Japan. Sort of a busy dude. Um so my great-grandfather writes him, and he just he he read this article that he was quoted in, that that the general had been quoted, something he he misquoted the Bible. So my great-grandfather wrote him this part of the story doesn't matter as much, but just wrote him and just said, is this true? Did you really say this? Man, I have a and and there's a handwritten response at the bottom of to his question. How accessible is that? That that was that used to be our country, that used to be our nation, that a the Supreme Allied Commander General, General MacArthur, took the time to respond to a podunk father asking him about, hey, did you say this about the Bible? And he's like, nope, I didn't. Like, but he took the time to to respond. Um and I have it framed in my office for for um for one reason. Because it doesn't matter if it's my employees or my customers or if I am blessed enough to be on the city council for the citizens of Abilene. Like, I'm never too big to not answer a question and to and to be there. So to answer your question, I think that's the problem. No, I'm not gonna agree with everybody, and everybody's not gonna agree with me. I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna make everybody in Abilene happy. There's gonna be a zoning issue come up, and I'm gonna have to vote one way, and I'm gonna have to. I hopefully I will apply uh principle and uh reason to each of those those issues. But you have to take the time and to listen to somebody and to, and regardless of what's in front of their name, if it's an R or a D or an I or whatever flag they're flying, you gotta listen to them. And uh, and I think that's the the the biggest problem with our nation right now is there we mean it's is social media sucks. I I I I'm sorry, it's great in so many in so many ways, but man, it's it's creating a divide because we don't have to we don't have to talk right like this. We don't we can we can just keyboard thug and and yeah post stuff and and and you don't have to sit down and go, hey, like why why do you feel this way? And uh so to answer your question, I think I'm I think I'm answering. I'm sorry, I kind of got on a on a tangent, but uh on city council, man, I I like I I I pray that I am accessible to everybody. I pray that after three years uh or however long that if if I'm if I'm blessed enough to to be elected, that people can go, man, he sat down, he answered my call, he and he he was accessible. And I and I'll and I'll say this, man, one thing that uh I I've gotten a chance to know all the the council members and and I think all of y'all are are really great. Um I think that's something sounds like he says, except yeah, except for Jay Patterson. Like he's really not done much in the in the two weeks. No, I like Jay. Um no, but I uh I think y'all have done that. I and and I think for you, I I I think that you you kind of built a uh um reputation of that of being able to be listened to and and uh and I think that's I think that's cool. Because yeah, agreeing with everybody, it's not gonna happen. That's you know, uh it's not gonna happen.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:07

But yeah. Your your story about MacArthur uh reminded me of a of a story that that I was I think I read it in, I can't remember the book, uh Team of Team of Rivals or something like that. But it was a book about Lincoln maybe five, seven years ago I read it. And uh Lincoln, President Lincoln would write out letters, and then he would uh, you know, because he was firing generals, he was, you know, dealing with Congress, Civil War, all this kind of stuff, and there was obviously a lot of passion, and he would get riled up, etc. So he would write out the letter, whether he was firing a general or or taking on a senator on an issue, he would write out the letter and he would put that letter in his desk drawer and he'd wait three days and then he would take it out. And if he still agreed with the sentiment and the message that he put in that letter, he would then send it out. But if he didn't, he would tear it up and not send it. And so he said that saved a lot of generals' careers and a lot of uh bad blood with with Congress because in that heat of that moment he would respond and it would destroy relationships. And I have applied that uh practicing law is very um there's a lot of passion, and that has come into my practice a lot more because I will write an email. The the the modern equivalent is I will write the email and then I'll be like, ooh, all right, I'm a little riled up on this, so I'll put it in drafts, and then I will come back to it typically the next day. I won't wait three days, but I'll come back to the next day. Okay, could do I still think the same way? And I apply that still, you know, with with messages from from residents when I was serving on the council, it would be all right, they're passionate, and I'm I want to respond with some heat as well. No, you're wrong, you're wrong. Here, here, here. And so I would write out the message a lot of times, and then I would save it and go, all right, I'll respond later, and I'll see if I still agree. And so cooling that um sentiment down, uh especially, you know, in general, I don't respond to comments on social media because rarely do you change someone's mind in comments. But every now and then I would write out a comment, reply, and then I would save it, and then I would come back a day and go, all right, it's needed. Um but I would encourage, you know, I've told Jay this and and I encourage anyone thinking about political office, you know, and I'm sure you've heard the equivalents of that, but there is a lot of value in going, let me let me not respond to this egregious statement yet. Let me circle back in a day when I'm calmer. Yeah, and maybe bring some around.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:26

Yeah, Proverbs talks about that of uh not being quick quick with the tongue. Yes. Um that's uh man, your your story about Lincoln, that's I think the 1860 version of the three dots, you know, text A. Yes. It's like when is he is he gonna text and then it like then it goes away?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:42

Yeah, yeah. That's a good analogy. Yeah, it's just a drawer. It's just a drawer. All right. Well, Ben, I appreciate you being on. I think you've given the listeners some insights into kind of what you'd bring as a city council member, and hopefully it's you know, the goal there is to give people insight and go, okay, oh, that that makes sense, or that's what I want. To hear that's the approach, and so hopefully it's given some insights. And uh the election uh early voting starts. This is a runoff again. This will be the fourth or fifth election for people this year. So just as a reminder, we've got another election. It's it starts this coming Monday. Uh early voting's all next week, and then the actual election day is June 13th. Um and this will be the runoff uh for City Council Place 4.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:23

Um thank you so much for being on. Dude, thanks for thanks a lot for having me, man. Uh and uh man, give me let me give you a shout out. Uh man, I think I think I think you're doing great with this this show. This is I I've uh being brought on. So I've I've watched a few and and uh I think you got a uh a pretty sweet gig here. And uh man, I hope uh all the best for you. Um hopefully you can find some uh fascinating people uh because I think you do a great job doing this, man, and and best of luck for you. Thank you. Yeah, dude.